User talk:Y.I. Pachankis

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Y.I., Welcome to the wiki! Please leave a note on my Talk page if you have any questions. Pat Palmer (talk) 10:18, 26 July 2023 (CDT)

Have you read CZ:Policy on Self-Promotion? Peter Jackson (talk) 05:28, 28 July 2023 (CDT)

White hole article

Unfortunately, the White hole article cannot be posted by you, but another contributor such as I could post it for you if you request that. I'd like to know whether you intend to contribute to the wiki in other places, or whether your only intention was to post this article and leave. Either way, the article as it now stands will have to be deleted shortly. Pat Palmer (talk) 08:51, 28 July 2023 (CDT)

Thank you for the feedback. I agree with your concern and hope you can create the white hole page. It is a very nitch science topic and I'll revise accordingly to arrange the content concerns. I am currently managing the black hole page. You can also supervise my edits. More sensitive will be later when I edit the COVID-19 contents. I regard scientific outreach in public media quite critical nowadays... Editing something I am passionate about first reduces my anxiety concerning the issues of global censorship.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 09:02, 28 July 2023 (CDT)

Y.I., In case you didn't understand, you may NOT personally make any edits to the newly recreated White hole page. You can develop a draft of that article in your sandbox area and ask me to install the changes from the draft into the main article, but you may NOT edit that article directly. It is against the self promotion policy. I will revert the edits you made there in the last 24 hours and install the draft for you on your sandbox, where you can ask me, when you think it's mature, to install the change by leaving a note on my user page. Your name MUST NOT appear in the edit history of that article. Please comply. Pat Palmer (talk) 09:30, 30 July 2023 (CDT)
Here is the sandboxed version of the article: User:Y.I._Pachankis/sandbox/White_hole. Please make your edits here and not on the official article, and when you think it's the way you like it, please notify me so that I can decide whether to install your changes or not. Pat Palmer (talk) 09:33, 30 July 2023 (CDT)
Y.I., I have left a message on User:Mark Widmer's talk page asking him to review your sandbox draft. If he approves it, he will copy its contents over to the main article. Because this topic involved your research, this is how it has to work in this wiki to avoid violating the self-promotion policy. Pat Palmer (talk) 09:41, 30 July 2023 (CDT)

Hi Pat Palmer. I think you have the same misunderstandings on "policy" and such wordings. First, I assume Citizendium is an NGO, but nowadays many NGOs follow the rules, or policies whatever they are labeled, but derive from the very purposes of essence of the policies to start with. I see your well-intention, but I need to address my concern on this tendency. Normally this is how fascism starts and develop into Nazism. If I had that time, or if that I don't care about the public issues and outreach, I can spend more time on my own science and research instead of wasting my time editing wikis. I don't want to talk too much about white holes, but anyhow you interpret it, suit yourself. Just make sure not to revert the COVID-19 issues into disinformation.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 09:53, 30 July 2023 (CDT)

Hi Pat Palmer, I just took a look at User:Mark Widmer's page. I don't know. I mean, I don't feel comfortable letting someone in retirement see what I have to say with my research, which I only cited my previous literature but don't think it's time making it too visible. But anyhow... He indeed looks to have well-suited judgments on this matter with his background.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 10:22, 30 July 2023 (CDT)

White Hole article updated


Thanks for writing the white hole article. I have reviewed the sandbox draft, and copied its content to the main article (as requested by Pat Palmer). I made one main edit, to make the "intro" section more at a beginner/non-expert level. Because the article is based on your own original research publications, you must not edit the article directly -- but you are welcome to ask me to do edits. Just edit my Talk/Discussion Page and add any request or comment at the bottom:


p.s. Welcome to Citizendium! Mark Widmer (talk) 10:50, 30 July 2023 (CDT)

Thanks Mark.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 00:43, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

your edits on COVID-19 were reverted, and that article is now protected

Y.I., I have warned you a couple time before and you don't seem to understand it. This is my last warning. You may NOT use your own research as a reference on any article in this wiki. It is forbidden by the self-promotion policy to use your own original research in references. You did this (again) on the COVID-19 article. I have reverted your edits there and protected that page, which I should have done well before this. That article was written by a public health expert whom wiki administrators invited, and we didn't really want anyone else working on it. IF you wish to revise that article, again you will have to do it in your sandbox and then ask me to review the changes. If I like them, I will then add them to the article. As you pointed out, COVID-19 is a highly controversial topic and there are many unsupported theories floated about it. We asked Gareth to write a bare-bones informational article that avoided mention of any of the theories about its origin. I imagine this will upset you, based on your comments, but I must warn you that if you cite your own papers on any article in this wiki again, I will have to ban you permanently. Also, I don't know anything about the International Journal of Innovative Science and Research Technology but many online sites seem to consider it a predatory journal, i.e., one that does not vet its articles as closely as it really claims to do. So I am definitely not going to have that on the COVID-19 article, and also you may not cite your own papers about it, which is original research that is not allowed either here, in Wikipedia, or in any reputable online encyclopedia. See CZ:Objectivity_Guidance about the reason we do not accept some sources. Pat Palmer (talk) 10:26, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

OR is allowed on Wikialpha: [1]. Whether that counts as reputable ... Peter Jackson (talk) 05:32, 1 August 2023 (CDT)

Well, kill as many people as you want with your disinformation excuses.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 10:30, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

Do as what you like with your presumptuous power.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 10:33, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

Also, if you believe so much about branding in the private sector journals, you should know that major disinformation approaches are targeted on Nature and the so-called SCI journals. Do your real research. Also, the structure you think is non-partial does not have any logics nor meta-logics that discovers any truths.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 10:39, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

Also, as a technical administrator, don't you see your own contradiction? You invited an expert for justification, whereas if someone did not do the research, that would not be an expert. You capture the technical aspects of website backend, yet you prefer branding yourself as author. Isn't this self-promotion inside of the platform?

Again, if this is your own private company, suit yourself.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 10:47, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

Don't try to justify other people's responses to your abuse as being emotional or irrational so as to suit your purpose of control / power over the platform. Also, empiricism with evidence does not mean theory. I have been polite enough since I noticed your tendency on handling structural power.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 10:53, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

Why don't you try writing a different article on COVID-19? Maybe it's title might by "How China handled COVID-19" or I don't know what. We allow multiple articles on one topic in this wiki. What we don't much like is someone taking a wrecking ball to an existing article without first asking about that on the Talk page of the article. Basic wiki etiquette. Pat Palmer (talk) 11:06, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

It was originated and first started in China. And any moral ethical concerns or international responsibilities or governmental responsibilities in public information make the discovering of facts and truths a necessity.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 11:11, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

BTW, would you like to see how many factual mistakes were there on the SARS page?

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 11:09, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

You probably know this, but all the changes you made to COVID-19 can still be accessed in the article's history in case you want to write a completely different article. And, I will take your word for it if there were factual errors on SARS; it's good to correct those. Also good to explain about that on the article's Talk page so other contributors can be better informed. I really do value your expertise and hope you'll continue working in the wiki. The legal status of this wiki is that it is a privately held domain and has never been made into a (legal) non-profit. But we operate it exactly as if it were a non-profit. Its only income is from contributions. No one is paid a salary, although we've occasionally had to hire a programmer (hourly) for upgrades. Our contributors get to know each other, over time, and we try to avoid big fights. I understand that you are frustrated right now. We'll be okay if you understand I do not intend any kind of sinister censorship; I'm trying to enforce the self-promotion policy because I think it is necessary for the credibility of the wiki's contents. We've had many people in the past attempting to use the wiki to promote their careers; there are real reasons this policy exists. Pat Palmer (talk) 11:37, 31 July 2023 (CDT)

Dear Pat Palmer,

Thanks very much for the information. Now I understand, and thank you very much in taking on the responsibilities with personal risks. I have been trying to establish an NGO for science communication and went through some information how to do that. I think it is better to be established in the U.S., given the governmental structures that can grant an NGO the essential freedoms in operations. I'll get back to you if you think it a good idea and at least three persons are needed for the fundamental structures. So, it'll have to be some topics on the long term operations and strategies for the NGO. Essentially, this will avoid too much personal risks in the legal affairs, and you can be less uptight. I noticed that one of the rules is that I can ignore the rules :).

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 05:12, 1 August 2023 (CDT)

I set up your sandbox and formatted your User page a bit; revert changes if you wish

Yang, We don't normally edit anyone's User page or sandbox, but I wanted to make sure you could locate your sandbox area, so I added a link to it to your User page. Contributors can use their sandbox to try out formatting or create draft articles. Nothing in your sandbox will be disturbed by others unless you ask someone to edit it, and also it won't be indexed by search engines, so that is a place you can create drafts of articles and experiment with formatting. Pat Palmer (talk) 09:00, 1 August 2023 (CDT)

Dear Pat Palmer,

Thanks. It's fine. I'll make the changes after the NGO is formally registered. Also, I think Wikipedia failed in making itself a knowledge map in the online environment. If you think it is a good direction in running Citizedium. A bottom-up knowledge map that adheres to fundamental facts and truths among the current disinformation and misinformation landscapes. And only NGOs can eliminate, or at least minimize, the structural incentives with appropriate legal and power structures.

--Y.I. Pachankis (talk) 10:17, 3 August 2023 (CDT)